Cerebrolysin (bringing in the big guns)

[onedayillsailagain]

So. I'm very spaced out currently. I'll add more about Cerebrolysin as soon as my brain permits, but basically it's porcine derived peptides which spark brain growth. Or something like that.. didn't get into details. I can't wait for NSI-189 lying around like this any longer, and this seems to have a high chance of helping me, moreover it seems rather similar save the RoA.

Anyway, many tout it as the most potent nootropic they've ever used. I've even read 2 accounts of it improving depersonalization, one of them quite drastically. I suggest you read through the (long) thread at Longecity however, if you're interested.

This one has been on the back of my mind for so long; I almost forgot it existed. When I first started looking into Nootropics, it was the first thing that caught my eye based on the (sometimes very impressive) user reports. However, the only downside is the RoA. Intramuscular injection. This is why I never bothered with it, as IM injections seemed rather extreme to me.

Though now more than ever I really, really, need something that works. The upside however is that it should work relatively quickly (1-20 days, with an average of 4-5 days) and should be highly efficacious if it works.

So, I went ahead and ordered myself 200ml (20 x 10ml) Cerebrolysin from Nootropic.eu. (warning: very expensive).
I'll be spending the coming days trying to figure out how to do intramuscular injections, ordering needles, etc. (I've never done an injection.. hell I've even missed a lot of shots!). The only fear I have is that I'll fuck up due to my current cognitive state (I barely made a sandwhich today.. hoping Aniracetam will help with that short-term), but other than that I'm pretty sure it should be harmless. And I guess.. would suck to waste almost 300 euros on a failed experiment and jabbing my thigh for nothing.

I haven't found a single mention of Cerebrolysin on HPPDonline.. Does anyone have any experience with this (I doubt it)?

I'm still reading in to it, but doses tend to be 5-10ml per day, either every other day, or 5 on 2 off. I figured 10ml 5 on 2 off for 4 weeks should be sufficient to gauge efficacy. Of course this is subject to adjustments.

Thoughts anyone?

[onedayillsailagain]

A collection of articles on Cerebrolysin

[hppd33]

Haha. Respect man! 

 

I wish you all the best with this experiment, i recognize so much in your storie's 

We will find a cure, no matter what!

[onedayillsailagain]

Thank you! And yes indeed we shall!

[andrewcb]

I got a few buddies who do steroids, I use to but it has been a lot of years ago. So here is some advise.

Shooting up is fairly easy and after you do it a few times it doesn't bother you, I could never do it to myself as I hate needles, having someone else do it makes it easier.

Always clean the top of your bottle before and after use.

If you open up a needle and drop it, toss it. My buddy caught a infection like this.

Buttocks, inner thighs and arms. If it is just like 2 shoots a week I would just go with buttocks.

Always clean the area you are going to inject.

You don't really have to do this but you can just to make sure you aren't in a vein, which is damn near impossible but purge your needle back to make sure no blood goes in.

I can't remember what size needle is used, it depends on what you are putting in really, but it is either a 20 or 22 gauge and 1 inch thick I believe.

That is about it for injecting, just be very clean, clean everything 2-3 times or you can get a infection. My buddy when he got a infection had a big lump deep in his buttock and couldn't sit down lol.

To be honest, you are going to hate shooting up 5 times a week and 5-10cc is a shit ton, it gets old really fast. I would start off 3 times a week for 8 weeks or so. You can do 4 shoots, I would do each buttock and each inner thigh, I really hate sticking crap in my arms. But regardless you will get tired of sticking yourself more then 3 times a week which I still didn't like, I like the 2x a week stuff lol. I am guessing, and this is on a hunch, since it can take 1-20 days to take effect that means it has to build up in your blood, does this mean that after your last shot it will stay in your system for up to 20 days like most steroids do? I will do some research on this when I get back.

[andrewcb]

I've done some reading on this and it seems awesome, very safe. I ran across N-PEP-12 which is a derivative of cerebrolysin. I don't know where this can be picked up or how far along trial it is, just ran across it and wanted to toss this in here. What I have read so far is it takes one month to kick in and the effects can last up to 3 months. One method is 5 days per week for 4 weeks and 2 days per week for another 8 weeks, I guess the first 4 weeks is to(I forget the proper term) get it in your system real quick(god what is the word I am thinking of). Me personally, I would just do 3 shots for 8-12 weeks. I don't know how it is cycled but probably can do this twice a year, 3 months of injection, 3 months afterwards it is still effective. So 6 months there then one more go around will finish your year. 4 weeks seems to short to do it, 5 shoots a week is kind of extreme but if shoots don't bother you go for it. I would really like to know how this goes and will be doing more reading! Good luck

 

I think the word I am looking for is loading or pre-loading lol

[andrewcb]

n-pep-12 http://memoprovecanada.com/      3 months worth for 100 bucks. Will try this is you like Cerebrolysin after my PRL trial.

http://www.longecity.org/forum/topic/63858-latest-stack-n-pep-12mexidoldexedrine-so-far-so-good/

 

Says it is oral Cerebrolysin. Oral obviously wouldn't be as good as IM but a option it you want to avoid needles. I don't know how true it is that it is the same as Cerebrolysin, just what this guy says.

[onedayillsailagain]

Thanks for the advice man! Yeah I'll be meticulous about the procedure... probably gonna print out a step-by-step guide, and watch some YouTube videos in replay. Still; seems like an easy process. I'll be injecting 5ml into 2 sites every day.. and I know sites must be rotated. So aside from the glutus maximus and the vastus lateralis, I'll have to find more sites to inject I guess.. But I'll figure that all out as well.

Indeed the effects are documented (and reported anecdotally) to persist beyond the injecting phase.
Yes 5 days a week seems a little extreme; but I figured pedal to the metal. The shots.. yeah I guess I'll get used to it. Guess my main problem will be finding enough injection sites. 4 weeks should be sufficient to see results as most people see results within the first week, for some it takes 2 weeks, but not much longer than that. And.. after that. If it does work, I wouldn't mind injecting it into my face 5 times a day if I had to.

Yes N-PEP-12 is the oral version.. Think I read it was 7 times less potent or so. There's also intranasal administration of Celebrolysin, but results are a bit controversial it seems. You could also IV; but that is more extreme than IM. One person is doing SubQ's. I'd be interested in whether sublingual would have a high bioavailability. Cool that you're gonna try it!

Well shipping was 5-15 days, so I'm hoping it'll be here sooner rather than later! (my guess is early December).

[Jay1]

Interesting, look forward to hearing how it goes.

[andrewcb]

Is this oil based or water? If it is oil......ouch! 

[onedayillsailagain]

Me too Jay!

I think it's water-based Andrew. From what I've read the shots are painless, or barely noticeable.
Also some people have compared it to NSI-189, claiming it's superior. I think NSI-189 was described as having faster thoughts, and having more thoughts, whilst Cerebrolysin was described as being calming and clarifying (like here). So that's interesting..
Meanwhile I've inquired about faster shipping options, seeing as it hasn't been shipped yet. The sooner the better, right?

Anyway I'll update once (I know when) it's here. Cheers.

edit: Has already been shipped. Should be here in about a week.
If anyone is going to try this; I've written my own simplified how-to IM injection guide, download here. Original online here.

[andrewcb]

Awesome, I hope this works out I don't mind sticking myself. Quick question, why did you decided to do 10ml vs 5 ml? Figure go big or go home? lol, and I might have over looked it but I couldn't find the mg/ml on this stuff on this site. My stupid little laptop wont let me open your guide, which guage needle and lenght of needle did you decide to go with? I would go with a 23 guage if it is water based and a 1 inch needle unless you got a lot of errr room between your skin and ass meat? lol

Thank you

[onedayillsailagain]

Yes that's exactly why! Pedal to the metal
Yeah idk about mg/ml. I opted for 24G 1" and 22G 1.5", these were the thinnest I could find in these lengths.
For the extra 5 euros I figured I might as well get both lengths.
Haha not sure! Been very sedentary so little muscle and relatively much fat.. kind of missing the good old days where I didn't have to question "Err.. is this a muscle?". In any case, I've read it's recommended to not inject the same site at least for another 7 days, so I'll need a total of 10 different injection sites.. I figured 2 on the leg, 2 on the bum.. and haven't come further than that, lol. Maybe 2 on the arm, and hope that by then it'll be fine to switch back to the leg, otherwise I gotta get creative.

The guide is a .odt file which is an OpenOffice file, which you can open with modern Word versions I believe, as well as LibreOffice if you're running Ubuntu like me

[andrewcb]

It would be nice if they could make it more potent where you only had to shoot up like 1 or 2cc. Maybe something you could ask them about? I would find out the mg of this stuff too you could be injecting some potent stuff to begin with lol. I can't open stuff like your guide, I am on what is called a google laptop which is crap. Can't dl anything I have to use apps which I don't even bother with lol.

 

Here is the kicker, you do your thing but just about anyone will tell you not to inject more then 3ml in one site. Going up to 5ml in one site on multiple spots is pushing it. If you ever need help with injections or advice go to anabolicminds.com......I haven't been on that site in forever but back then there were a lot of nice people who had no problem helping others, but nowadays everyone seems to be internet thugs.

 

Me personally would stretch it out........5ml 3x a week for 8 to 12 weeks, that is kind of how a steroid cycle would go. Using longer with less shots is better then a lot at once since it has to build up but just my opinion. Also is there a taper down period you got to do or anything when you get off or is it safe just to quit? Don't rush things, I know you want to feel on top of the world again but taking it easy and enjoy the subtle positive changes you get. I wish I  say I feel better day by day but I might feel only a tad bit better every week or 2, but each of those weeks I get 1% better add up and I will be myself again sooner or later.

 

Good luck and let me know how it is going. Read my PRL I am fixing to post, some positives going on.

[onedayillsailagain]

Got it in the mail today, as well as my other supplies.

It's 215.2mg/ml apparently.

I thought  5ml/spot was the limit, and that 10ml/spot was pushing it.. ah well; seems to be safe.
I have enough to do it every day, so even if it needs to build up, I don't see much reason to do less.
I think it's safe to quit whenever.

Anyhow; I'm gonna do 1 injection in a few, then wait a couple of hours and do the other.
Think I've bought the wrong syringes.. Damnit. See here.
I'll update with any progress.

[Puppeteer]

Waiting with bated breath for the overall outcome. Can't tell if you worked out that the needle are okay or not?

[onedayillsailagain]

Well.. still alive. The whole ordeal made me very anxious and subsequently more dissociated, so it's hard to gauge any effects yet, but how can one expect that after 3 hours? I've some worries that somehow I messed up (mainly worries about infections), but I have no real way to verify or debunk that. The gear I had turned out to be fine, btw. It's actually very painless... I'll update in due time.

[onedayillsailagain]

Day 2: No benefits noticed yet. Had a headache this morning. Sleep wasn't much different than usual. Injected a few hours ago..
Very tired and dissociated; nothing new.

[onedayillsailagain]

Had some trouble falling asleep last night. Some anxiety I suppose. Also, I awoke twice last night during sleep, which is rather unusual for me.
Other things I've noticed are very brief flashes of memory.. I was cooking an egg this morning, and all of a sudden remembered cooking an egg at a friends house 2 years ago, but the memory faded very fast. I used to have these kind of transient memories, but they ceased about 3 months ago. It's interesting to see them coming back, and I hope this stays and amplifies (especially the length of the memory staying in my mind). Other than that I noticed that I've dreamed a lot, and my dreams have been different.. felt different. Woke up with a better mood too, now I'll have to see whether it stays that way.
Could still all be placebo, but yeah just for the record I guess. Will commence 3rd set of injections later this morning.

[onedayillsailagain]

Day 4: no benefits yet

Sleep is still disrupted; slept worse than yesterday. Still couch-bound and spaced out. Having a headache today (uncommon for me).

[onedayillsailagain]

Had a 2 day break after day 5, and started week 2 today.
Nothing to report yet.. Watching all episodes of "Lost". Obviously laying around doing nothing isn't likely to contribute to improvement, but currently I (still) can't do much more, or at least can't conceive doing so. In any case, I guess theoretically it shouldn't matter too much. Anti-depressive action should work regardless eventually. I've adjusted my expectations to see results around week the end of week 2 or 3, though of course I'm hoping to see them sooner.
Almost immediately after I finish, I'll be going on a 2 month trial of NSI-189. Eventually something has gotta start helping....

[onedayillsailagain]

Did my 10th set of injections yesterday, so that was week 2. Nothing to report yet alas.. bit disappointing, but I'll keep at it for the remaining 2 weeks I've left.
I was doing a bit of reading, and found that Cerebrolysin is primarily synaptogenic, whereas NSI-189 is primarily neurogenic.
So I was thinking that maybe NSI-189 may be more helpful for those with a damaged hippocampus.
Maybe a better course of action would be a couple of months NSI-189, and then a cycle of Cerebrolysin to help the new cells form synapses.
Also, 7,8-dihydroxyflavone is in the works, which appears to be quite the potent neurogenic anti-depressant nootropic compound as well, so that's on my list.

Perhaps after NSI-189 I'll do a few months of that.
For anyone considering trying Cerebrolysin; I'd suggest try NSI-189 or 7,8-DHF first. I only did Cere because NSI-189 wasn't yet available, and I can't sit around knowing I'm trying nothing new whilst waiting for it.

[Puppeteer]

Bummer to hear that you aren't getting any of the wow effects people often report in the early days of cerebrolysin. Presumably though, even if nothing's immediately apparent, it's doing something behind the scenes, so hopefully at the very least you'll be gaining some subtle improvements.

[andrewcb]

Did my 10th set of injections yesterday, so that was week 2. Nothing to report yet alas.. bit disappointing, but I'll keep at it for the remaining 2 weeks I've left.

I was doing a bit of reading, and found that Cerebrolysin is primarily synaptogenic, whereas NSI-189 is primarily neurogenic.

So I was thinking that maybe NSI-189 may be more helpful for those with a damaged hippocampus.

Maybe a better course of action would be a couple of months NSI-189, and then a cycle of Cerebrolysin to help the new cells form synapses.

Also, 7,8-dihydroxyflavone is in the works, which appears to be quite the potent neurogenic anti-depressant nootropic compound as well, so that's on my list.

Perhaps after NSI-189 I'll do a few months of that.

For anyone considering trying Cerebrolysin; I'd suggest try NSI-189 or 7,8-DHF first. I only did Cere because NSI-189 wasn't yet available, and I can't sit around knowing I'm trying nothing new whilst waiting for it.

Your NSI comes in next month correct? This is what I can't wait to hear about!

[onedayillsailagain]

Thanks. Yeah I hope that I'll see improvements soon, and otherwise I guess no harm done. Maybe I'll see them after I quit.. who knows.
Yes I should be getting NSI-189 late Dec / early Jan. I found another source though, which I'll post in the adequate topic.