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Another Introduction of woodrose-caused maybe-HPPD


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I've just joined this forum. I am from Germany and therefore my English might be bad sometimes, because I am not familiar with terms and words to use when talking about drugs in English. But I hope you are going to understand what I am trying to explain.

I am not even sure, if the things I experience are really to be called HPPD. But I've read a lot about this topic and wrote in another german community (Land der Träume) about it, and I guess everything points into this direction.

I started taking Hawaiian Baby Woodrose in December 2010. I had four trips in total. The last one was at 27th January 2011 and it never stopped. I mean, since then I feel different.

This last trip was a spontaneous one, just chewing two or three seeds and then my family interrupted me before it could really start for dinner. I already felt it coming up, but then I needed to hide.

Other drugs I took before Woodrose are Kratom,Syrian rue (Pegganum harmalal) and Nutmeg. After a while (maybe 2 months) I took some Kratom to "cure" the woodrose-feelings. It felt like heaven. The woodrose parted my inner thoughts and Kratom melted it all together again. But when the effect went away, I felt worse than before. I took about 80 grams of Kratom in two weeks. and then for a long time nothing. I just coped with the symptoms somehow. But about 2 months ago,I started again with Kratom and Tramadol. The last one has a immense effect on me, I need very less to get the feeling.

My HPPD-like symptoms come and go. Well, actually they are always there, but sometimes it is very hard for me to get along with them.

About a week ago it started to be hard again. Since yesterday evening they go away slowly, and therefore I am only able to write about it, before I could not concentrate on typing and stuff like that, because my keyboard looked like a dancehall for letters.

Today I tried to not notice the things I see. And that made it more creative. There were bright white rectangle flying through my field of vision or blue stripes following me. The shade of blue was like water in typical carribean beaches.

I also notice halos around objects.

As already said, letters are dancing with each other, and when reading texts the black color melts together, I see patterns in it, these patters are moving and changing colours, mostly it becomes a dark green or violet or blue.

Often there is something like a grey dust above everything, like static on TV, but in grey and with smaller grains.

I also see afterimages sometimes, and I have always Closed-Eye-Visions. They are annoying when they don't let me fall asleep. I mean, how can someone sleep, when seeing a firework or a giraffe eating leaves?

I see floaters on the blue sky and on walls, no need to look there for long time, they com imidiatly

A few months ago I was in the theatre. There I saw trails of the actors. Actually there have been around 5 people on stage but for me there were lots more. I still saw where they stood before. The stage was mostly white with less prop on it.

And it feels like objects are moving but they don't do it for real.

Often there are moving colourful objects in my field of vision. They always have the same colour, but this colour can change. I want to say, that at a time there are some balls in the same colour, but the next day they all have another colour.

I am pretty sure, I forgot many many things. Some even have gone already. I feel like that for more than a year...

For example I don't have that much pseudo-hallucinations anymore. At the beginning I saw a special type of snails everywhere I went. (I guess it was a hallucination, I can't imagine that there are 30 snails in my room really)

Now there are only the colours and wrong movements.

When I want to push everything away, it intensifies for more attention.

In summer it seems worse than in winter.

When I have lots of stress it gets worse too

and it also worsens when I am hungry and tired.

right now my black keyboard looks very green. and the edges blur.

When listening to special kinds of music, I feel better. Music like Pink Floyd or Jefferson Airplane or other psychedelic stuff.


So, to people who know more about HPPD, does that sound like it?

If there are questions, please feel free to ask me. Or if my phrasing is not good enough.

Another thing: A while ago, while taking Kratom, I painted my lamp with blue colour. I also have a blue cloth in front of my window against the sunlight. And somehow I feel finer in this blue light than in other lightbulb-light. Is there somewhere something about that?

and does anyone know about if Kratom is good for stuff like this or if it "harms" me more?

I also want to learn riding motorbike. But I am afraid of it with all these colorful balls in my Field of vision. Anyone has experience with that? I reallly want to feel this freedom,but I guess it could be hard...

Thanks for reading and I hope you could understand, what I am trying to say :)


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Welcome to the forum!

Your case definetily sounds like hppd, do you have any other visual disturbances like after images and visual snow? And for the love of god, quit doing all sorts of drugs this instant, you have no idea how deep the rabbit hole goes and believe me, you do not want to find out.

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Thank you for replying :-)

I do see visual snow, and now I know the right term for it.

About the after images I am not sure. When looking at these pictures which are palying with that effect (where you look for 30 seconds at the picture and then on a white wall and then you see something funny or whatsover) it does not work. But when I am not "wanting" to have afterimages they could be there. But I don't know for sure.

I guess you are right with me telling to quit drugs. It would be the only reasonable thing. But today I took some Kratom, to "forget" about the hppd things. and it works, but it's not good. I know.

What do you think about taking Valerian root? I've reads somewhere (probably on neurosoup.com) that it should help... is there anyone who tried that?

And I will not take anything "big". It could become so much worse. I already "lost" many of my symptoms. And I really want to follow that way.

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Sadly it sounds like you have a pretty severe case of HPPD, however your case seems kind of unique. Valerian root sounds fine, some of the members here use it to get to sleep easier and report no ill affects. I've yet to try it but I just ordered some form Amazon so hopefully it'll ship soon. If you have really bad anxiety I'd suggest getting some form of benzo script for occasional use, but be wary of addiction. As for other drugs, defineitely never even think about taking hallucinogens or MDMA. Weed is also a big no-no. Alcohol can also really affect visuals negatively. I'm not entirely sure of how stimulants and other drugs affect HPPD. Opiates are known for having few physical adverse effects on the body (except for the obvious addiction and terrible WDs) and I'm pretty sure they don't really make visuals worse, but you should just stay away from them in general. I've seen some family members go down the wrong path in life from opiates and end up in jail as 22 year old losers. Bottom line, STAY SOBER if you want to recover. It's not even about taking "anything 'big'", because soft drugs like weed can really aggravate and permanently worsen HPPD.

...However I am kind of interested in how kratom affects HPPD. it's legal where I live so its very tempting. Did you notice it worsening your symptoms? I don't really know the difference between opiates and opioids so this kind of interests me.

And it feels like objects are moving but they don't do it for real.

I hated this feeling, but I attributed it mainly to anxiety/PTSD and since my anxiety has gotten better it's gone away. It's funny you feel your symptoms worsen in the summer because I find the opposite. Also, you should try motorbiking! I read that extreme sports that cause a larger amount of dopamine to be released in the brain can actually ease symptoms. Whatever you do, if you stay healthy and sober you'll eventually heal up.

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@ cs1234:

I had to laugh when I read that you consider me as a "severe case". I mean I have those symptoms for more than a year. They have been so much worse in the past, so much more different things. Now there are just the leftovers so to speak. I feel so much better than a year ago. And I just mentioned the things which are present. I wonder what words youand everyonelse would use if I would be able to put everything ever experienced here...

I've ordered valerian root too, but from dragonspice. this shop is really cool. Is it allowed to say here something like that? If not, please don't be mad with me.

I don't like the taste of alcohol and never smoked so far. For me, Kratom is very cool. Everything you see/feel/hear/do feels perfect. If there is someone able to understand German here, visit land-der-traeume.de and look for everything written by WieseUntermApfelbaum. That's me.

There are some visual things with Kratom, but they don't annoy you. They just belong to the perfect world.

The problem is, you need to get the right amount. I have indo commercial kratom here, and weeks ago it caused more visual disturbance. It was different, and not the hppd-things triggered. I felt uncomfy nonetheless. Never felt that with Kratom before. there for I prefer Thai (whatever).

Kratom also has a nice afterglow at the next day. I still feel fine with everything.

Therfore Kratom is very dangerous I think. You get along with everything, you swim through the nothing and it feels so nice, you want to do it over and over again.

My fav season is winter, that might be the reason.

Thanks for cheering me up and I will try to get to learn motorcycling very soon :-)

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I'm glad that your symptoms really aren't really that bad haha I guess I just misread some of your original post.

Yeah y'know I've heard that kratom can give visuals, but that it affects a different part of the brain than the part that gives you HPPD. Kratom is an opioid with some stimulating effects so I know that feeling...it's hard to stay away from those kind of euphoric drugs but I think you can get physically addicted to it :( so be careful. I might give it a try some day soon but for now I'm just stayin sober and healing up my brain (except a little klonopin every now and then). Haha I think I'll stock up on some thai kratom before it goes illegal though. just for future reference, what's your average dose?

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I am definetely carfeul with my Kratom. Next time taking will be in August. Not before. and maybe later, if I don't feel like taking it.

I started with 3 grams, but now I am up to 5 to 6 grams for a proper feeling.

Thai is a good one, in my opinion. There I had no visuals in the past, that's why I've been a bit scared of the indo-visuals, have never read about that before.

Another question: When my boyfriend is here and we are close to eachother, the CEVs and other stuff gets worse. Is that "normal"?

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Are you anxious around him for any reason? Like are you deep down inside super scared of what he thinks of you? That's all that I can think of.

Also I am curious as to what the visuals are from kratom since you mentioned it. So kratom doesn't affect HPPD?

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I thought it would be "normal for everybody" to worry about what other people think of, especially the people you like/love...

so yes, I am anxious.

I just want the best for him...why did he chose someone like me with all these problems? he deserves someone better, smeone who can look at things and see them as anyone else...

another person I asked about that love-topic meant it could be about the dopamine and serotonin. She said there is more when love is around and there are theories saying hppd is caused somehow by the two of them.

My Kratom visuals... the letters on the keyboard were moving. now they do it hppd-like, but the opioid-moving was different somehow, I don't know how to explain. And I saw lots of vivid and colourful CEVs. Iguess they have been different from my normal ones too, otherwise I wouldn't have noticed them, right?

I don't know about what happens in the brain, therfore I will not say that Kratom has to affect on hppd.

but what it does feels good. At least in my case hppd doesn't interfere with kratom. maybe the hppdsymptoms stay as they are, but you are too sedated to notice. Kratom can also have a stimulating/activating effect. I never tried that. It all depends on what you take. and because i took it so "often" i need 6 grams for a sedating feeling. the more you take it the more you need...

I am pretty sure there is a higher chance for hppd-having people to get addicted to this kind of drug. It just made me feel fine with everything. and you get really let yourself go...you feel nothing, there is nothing on your mind.

but little kratom is shy. you need to make your set and setting well. no disturbance and the right music for example. What is right for you, you have to find out. Kratom is very subtile. you can easily push it away when you have to talk to someone or the phone is ringing or you need to go somewhere. Although, walking and riding a bike and driving in a car (as a front-seat passanger, not yourself driving it!!!) feels a lot like flying. And when you really want to have a good time, it works perfectly.

some people complain about the taste, but it's not too bad. You can handle it.

oh, and btw, many people get stomach ache or other byeffects, but I don't. never felt bad and I have lots of experience. maybe i am just lucky or hppd is causing that?

yeah, Kratom definetly feels fine for me. But I don't know about the medical side... it could make everything worse but I don't think so.

Unfortunately there is lots of potential for addiction, but you read everywhere that there is NOT. I don't understand that...

it feels awesome when you have no cevs when closing your eyes and have no thoughts in mind and are completely relaxed and so on

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Don't get me wrong, anxiousness/anxiety/stress are totally normal for everybody. But we HPPDers are super sensitive to it. All I can really suggest for you is to just keep trying to put your mind off of HPPD.

Also I think it's pretty interesting how you say psychedelic music makes you feel better. I'm a huge pink floyd fan too! But the song 'on the run' is just a total bad vibe. It makes me nervous and sweaty just listening to it. I'm glad I didn't hear it on acid lol. I guess that's the kind of feeling the band wanted people to get out of it though...the feeling of being on the run from something scary. Anyways I can go on and on about pink floyd and the themes of all their music/albums but I'll get to the point here. when I listen to trippy music like hendrix or the grateful dead I feel totally at peace with my HPPD; listening to that kind of music almost makes me enjoy the visuals. It's weird especially considering that I'm pretty sure I have PTSD from a bad trip.

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Herzlich willkommen im Forum^^

as for psychodelic music iam lovin it post HPPD i love melancholic electro and Neo-folk.

i had this anxiuos feeling while lookin in my girlfriends eyes too at the beginning of my HPPD but it disappeared.

i remembered the looking of her eyes while she was on a bad trip but this has gone in the first weeks, i think it was related to the fear of telling her about HPPD. dont have done it yet, because iam afraid that she could develop it too when she knows about it. she is very anxious when i talk about my/our experiences on drugs with friends. she mostlly leaves the room in such a situation. i have told her about the snow and a few other symptoms and that i think its because of the last decade of heavy weed abusing (maybe it is who knows).

naja dann mal viel Spaß hier im forum und grüße ausem Ruhrpott^^

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I also have a big problem with telling what is normal and what is HPPD-caused. I have no idea what life looked before, so I just throw in stuff which I assume to be special. I am pretty sure I am so used to some stuff that I don't even notice it as "new" anymore...

Mostly I am listening to the album Meddle. But some parts in the middle of Echoes make me feel uncomfy. When there is some drug in me it's alright. But listening sober to it is hard. I get some kind of uneasy feeling and panic.

But songs like Uncomfortably Numb are just perfect.

So I won't listen to "on the run". never did that btw. and if you say it is somehow bad I am glad to not experience it myself.

I've got to know my boyfriend better after getting hppd, but the first wave was gone, I was on a kind of plateau, but now and then it developes... sometimes in a positive way but more often in a negative way.

While this first wave of hppd, I had email contact to a person. an adult man. i told him everything, he knew about me taking drugs. but he didn't take the symptoms that seriously. He thought it would be normal. Mostly I was just writing and he not replying. sometimes he did. Without him I would have lost every connection to the real world. No one else knew about me taking drugs and suffering from that. He calmed me down. I forced myself to think "It can't be that worse, when he think it's not". It really helped to think of him. Before my hppd we met. and a mnths or two ago too. I always feel so much better when he is around. Sometimes the thoughts are enough to lighten my hppd. But when he actually is with me somewhere, I nearly forget about the hppd completely. It feels awesome to not have visual snow!!!

But now: he wants to quit contact!!! he thinks its not good in longterm... I can'tlet him go. at least I want one last meeting for a real goodbye. not an e-mail goodbye. that would be cruel. I am nearly crying alltimelong since he told me that he doesn't want to sepnd time with me anymore. He is my non-medicamental and non-drug treatment for hppd. I just fu****ing need him!!

he doesn't know. I sent him a link to my tripreports but he didn't look at them. How can I beg him for a final meeting? I just want to tell him what he means to me. How he made my life worth living. I always had something to look forward to.

Does anyone else experience something like that? when you just kind of getting addicted to the persons who helped you at the very beginning and how they make you feel better?

Is there a scientific explanation for something like that? or does it to the Talkiing-helps section? and I talked/wrote everything to him... but I also have the feeling that the deepness of my symptoms did not come out clearly... but it really felt good to share this with someone.

@nepuinthesky: endlich mal wen Deutsches hier gefunden ;-) Ich bin übrigens aus Niedersachsen. Und dir wünsche ich auch noch eine schöne Zeit hier

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talking helps a lot and its a good way to help you out of crisis. but i only use this forum to talk about this disorder. normaly people who are not affected wont understand (thats the same for every disorder/disease). only a few people i know know about my symptoms but not about HPPD. i told them in the beginning but they never asked again. noone notice it because my vision is only a mess and i have nocomorbid diseases. also i dont want to stress friends about it. i live my life and do the best i can in my job, family and so on. but sometimes i have to talk and i think thats the best place here.

the best way for me to forget about my disorder is to go into clubs and do sports. keep yourself busy thats the best advise.

naja mein englisch ist bei weitem nicht so gut wie deins^^ aber wenn du mal in deutsch reden magst oder mentale unterstützung brauchst schreib mir ne PM. ich mags net so gern hier deutsch zu reden im öffentlichen forum das grenzt zu viele leute aus.

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well, I don't like going to clubs but being active otherwise sounds fine. soon I have no school for six weeks... what to do then? I am sure i will get bored sooner or later...that scares me a bit.

I wrote an sms to the friend, I asked for a final meeting, as a symbolic good bye and for talking. so far, no answer.

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i have hollidays for two and a half month because i completed my vocational training and begin my new job in august^^ sometimes its hard to find distraction but then i close my eyes and listen to music for example and maybe the wether will get better so youre able to enjoy the nature my symptoms are very low outside.

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yeah, going out is always good. maybe I'll beg my boyfriend to take long walks with me.

Listening to music helps me too, but closing my eyes is not good.

I can handle the visual snow and all the other things I see, but those CEVs are much harder. I haven't sleep properly for a week or more because of them... and when tiredness is too big to keep eyes open I fall into dreams which don't let me rest... I don't feel relaxed in the morning...

and the weather here is already "good", but too hot for me. I prefer snow. or at least not up to 30°celsius...

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Your case is different from mine because you seem to have extreme visuals but not as much mental effects like anxiety or derealization (correct me if I'm wrong). I was the opposite but I'm nearly cured now. Yesterday was the first time I had any major symptoms in a month. Valrian root is good, ecspeacially if CEVs are keeping ou from sleeping. Stay sober, hydrated, busy, and healthy and you will see some improvement.Talking about HPPD helps a lot. I dont use the term HPPD but I tell basically everyone that shrooms messed up my head. Good Luck!

I loved psychedelic music before HPPD but it kinda creeps me out now. II love PInk Floyd (I'm wearing a pink floyd shirt right now). On the run is a powerful song even when I was sober before HPPD listening to it would make me dizzy and feel like I was going to fall over. Pink Floyd and the beatles are the two greatest bands ever.

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I had lots of mental effects in the past. But I am living with the whole stuff for about one year and five months.

The mental stuff faded away over time, therefore the optics developed.

I hope you understand when I don't want to go too deep into detail about my mental problems, because I am afraid they might come back when thinking about them too much...

some kind of anxiety still exists, but it is nothing compared to what have been.

and i felt like there are multiple mes...just different persons in me, talking to and fighting eachother in my head.

and so many more things...

I hope I get the package soon with the valerian root inside. I'd prefer to buy it in a "real shop", but there was none here who offered pure valerian root, at least I wasn't able to find it. therefore I'd had to use the internet...

Today I drank a lot :-)

and I guess I am going to annoy my boyfriend with telling him even more things about my visuals, but this weekend he is not in town...

anyway, thanks for all the good wishes and I'll return them to everybody of you!

I really hope this forum can change its name somewhen, when no one has any problems left!! *dreaming*


Edit: Just to complete the list of my symptoms:

I also have starburst and some light case of restless legs syndrom...

and I did not sleep this last night at all.

I just was to fu**ing afraid of clsoing my eyes. sometimes I can't handle CEVs and the dreams at night.

When there is school the next day, I try to sleep at least a few hours, but it's weekend now, and therefore I stayed awake. I've read a lot here and listened to music. I've ehard noises in the songs which are definetly not there and the singers seemed to sing faster but the song lasted longer. How ist that working? That's senseless, it sounds faster but lasts an eternity...

Is there anything to do against those CEVs? (valerian root I will try as soon as it arrives, maybe today, I really hope so)

Edited by Meadow
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why can you edit a posting only once?

well, so I have to write another one:

I forgot to add Depersonalization and Derealization to my list as well. It is hardly noticable nowadays, but it has been a huge "problem" for me. I analyzed my behaviour all the time, I really felt like... yeah, don't know how to explain. people who have it, know it..

am i just used to it or did it go away? I can't say...


F*** it. I know why my symptoms worsened... when visiting a friend, we chilled and drank some beer. it has only 3% alkohol and a taste of woodruff.

I don't know huch much I drank but not that much actually, we shared the bottles, and he definetely drank more, but it was 5 0,33Liter bottles in total...

I shouldn't have done that, but I did not think about my hppd at that moment....


and I haven't slept this night. I just couldn't make me close my eyes for the visuals to take me...

now the symptoms worsened...i see flashlights everywhere, my head feels like a mess, when sitting or standing or walking i feel like sitting in a caroussel (this thing with seats which spins)

and my mouth feels strange...

so does everything i touch

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Well after two nights of no sleep it makes since that your having a hard time. I had CEVS for the first time in a while the other night but since I knew that they would go away (like they did after having them everynight for about a month) I actually enjoyed them. If you're stilll waiting for the valerian root then go out and get some melatonin you need to sleep. I know its easier said then done but try to enjoy the CEVs, you will stop having them soon and you may realize that you miss them a little.

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I've got the package yesterday afternoon. I made a tea immediatly and finally I could relax and even sleep a little, but then my mom woke me up. Have been very drowsy for a couple of hours.

For my evening/night sleep I made another tea. This stuff works very quickly :-) There have been some light CEVs at the beginning but a million times lighter than usual. I fall nicely asleep, no annyoing dream (for the first time in a bunch of weeks I woke up with no stupid dream in mind!!) and well rested. Normally I wake up pretty early, but today it's been 7:30, for me, that is late ;-)

Yeah, sometimes those CEVs can be funny and cool, but not when they keep you away from sleeping all the time. I don't have them only when wanting to sleep. If I'd close my eyes now, there would be something. Even when blinking there is something. Too fast for me to realize what exactly, but there are some colours and patterns...

Maybe I am really going to miss them, but I also missed a good night's sleep!!!

Edit: To state this for eternity: Valerian Root feels so much better than opioids(at least for me)!!! and I am pretty sure it is less "dangerous" so I am really happy now! I feel better without making everything worse in long term.

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it seems, that I need it to get some sleep... last night I tried it without... I ended up crying like a little baby and I was really afarif of harming myself... theses are not my own thoughts, I don't want to harm this body.

thanks so much to everyone who wrote here. you really encouraged me. I don't know where I would be without knowing about Valerian root and just every word you wrote helped we a lot!! thanks so much.

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